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Osiris' Rogue Guide v3(New)
Stealth FAQ (EU)
Grinding Guide 1.0
Have you adapted yet?
Now that TBC has let the dust settled a bit then the question has to be asked...... Was all the whining worth while?
Every time a major release comes out everyone shouts about getting nerfed. You goto the lock forums and they are shouting about being the worst and how rogues are going to 'pwn', then you go back to the rogue forum and they are unhappy because the locks are getting all the good stuff.
bla bla bla pish bla...
For me, I am enjoying the new stuff that has been thrown at us. I changed to the sub tree from combat once I hit 60 and thought that I was going to back to combat for leveling in TBC but I have stuck with sub because of the additional AP and agi. Also shadowstep has been great for me when it comes to ganking - especially from big drops. Now I can focus on who I want, jump and SS once in range and not loose stealth.
The ony time I have thought of changing is if I manage to get some really nice maces then try going back to combat with them to give that a try. Until that happens I am happy with the way things are.
Now, after the update/addon I read all over the place how awesome mutilate is and how good going deep into any one of the 3 trees is.
Anyway, how are you guys coping with the patch and d'you really think we have been 'nerfed'?
Every time a major release comes out everyone shouts about getting nerfed. You goto the lock forums and they are shouting about being the worst and how rogues are going to 'pwn', then you go back to the rogue forum and they are unhappy because the locks are getting all the good stuff.
bla bla bla pish bla...
For me, I am enjoying the new stuff that has been thrown at us. I changed to the sub tree from combat once I hit 60 and thought that I was going to back to combat for leveling in TBC but I have stuck with sub because of the additional AP and agi. Also shadowstep has been great for me when it comes to ganking - especially from big drops. Now I can focus on who I want, jump and SS once in range and not loose stealth.
The ony time I have thought of changing is if I manage to get some really nice maces then try going back to combat with them to give that a try. Until that happens I am happy with the way things are.
Now, after the update/addon I read all over the place how awesome mutilate is and how good going deep into any one of the 3 trees is.
Anyway, how are you guys coping with the patch and d'you really think we have been 'nerfed'?
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posted by ntrailz at 1/29/2007
Cerias Shadows
Zyk
Osiris
Khormid
17 Comments:
We stopped structurally raiding around christmas, so once 2.01 came out I switched my raiding combat build to a Mutilate build.
I stuck with that after TBC came out, and I must say, its proven itself both in Raids and solo grinding. Its a LOT of fun.
For the leveling instances I have felt the need to go down the subtelty tree a little though, for the Improved Sap mostly. I dont know if that will remain usefull. If it doesnt, like before, I will take some some stuff relating to damage in the combat tree.. or possibily improve my poison abilities. With mutilate, the assassination tree is gonna remain my favorite tree.
Got cloak of shadows last night when i dinged. IMO at 1 minute cooldown, this makes us totally imba.
I don't think we were nerfed at all... but so many of the other classes got buffed it almost feels like we were nerfed.
- Grimfrik
I gotta admit, even with the new talents and skills, I was a bit worried pre-TBC. Locks were pwning everything it seemed. But in the TBC instances, I still seem to be leading the meters. And although I'm still iffy on Envenom, I like Mutilate a lot. Combat daggers was okay for top-dps in PVE raids, and may be still, but it wasn't fun to play. Assassination... now there's a happy Rogue!
Binjali
Terenas
I was and still am combat swords. And I'm very happy with how rogues are doing. It's been said that rogues are machines now...and I said rogues were machines...now they are even meaner machines. I love the stat changes they have made and I am very happy over all with WoW2.
-Carimm
I don't think we were nerfed Hmm in fact we were not buffed like the other classes with their pets ^^ imho useless for rogues as darkness and stealth are our companions ;-)
My tree is still very combat oriented because it's very efficient for killing mobs quickly, I'll try mutilate for 65+.
I tried any spec before BC, enjoying plus or minus for each ones. At BC, I spec Combat Maces for leveling, because I always find it fun and good for that. And now I'm 69 and waiting to valid 2 things to be 70, I can say that I have absolutely no regret. Once I "ding" my level 70, I will surely try again each spec, and I know I will continue to love them each ones anyway.
All the tree is actually good, whatever you choose. The only thing that change is your way of playing. I feel like I discover my rogue again, and this is so good.
I personnaly say "Thanks Blizzard to give us a new rogue, as powerful as before, but with so much more fun".
Ulric - [EU]Garona
we haven't been nerfed it's only that pre-TBC all the classes had been buffed except rogues, I mean nearly anybody had the 41 talents cause it would have giving you a lol build with more weaknesses then the normal builds. Then take a look at the locks and druid, they all had 41 talents, 90% of the locks had Felguard and 99% of the druids had mangle.
But now that TBC is out we have properly excess to the 41 talents, and some new moves like Cloak of Shadows and deadly throw.
This makes rogues alot more powerfull, I'm not sure what tree I
m gonna pick but probably combat/hemo mace, I think this is the most powerfull spec for the arena, but I might spec combat mutilate or 30/0/31 too, not sure yet.
i personally love the steady DPS of combat swords. its kinda boring but sometimes simplicity is nice when you have as much on your plate as we do with TBC. I definately dont feel nerfed.. if anything the whole no damage scaling for druids is a nerf hah... suckers.. In any case i basically love something about each spec and whenever i spec one way im usually really happy with it since there are so many different battle strategies to make each little talent skill useful. Rock on Rogues
I admit I am intrigued by mutilate; I'm sure I will try it at some point when I have two appropriate daggers. But I've stuck with combat daggers. At 2.01 I went with imp sap, relentless, and lethality over combat potency and surprise attacks, but last night I dinged 68 and went full 41pt combat.
We ran Sethekk Halls soon afterward and it worked out well, though a (very good) oomkin came close to my damage. It's hard to see a benefit from combat potency when mobs go down in 5-10 seconds, whereas mutilate would be awesome for that.
I'm sure combat daggers is my future for endgame. With the tougher, longer fights in heroic mode, and that 50BoJ dagger for sale in Shattrath that practically begs for combat potency, I just can't see any other build keeping up.
As far as our changes overall, I'm happy. I hate that our crit rate falls with every ding, and druids and locks are definitely gaining on us on the meters. However, I still do the most damage, and with CloS and the new & improved imp sap, my 5man utility is way up. I love seeing these advertisements in general chat now: "lf1m mage or rogue w/imp sap"
I'm still doing sub to level. It's just too hard on a PvP server without enhanced stealth abilities like MOD and Camo.
Perhaps once I'm 70 and raiding I'll consider a combat or mutilate build.
I'm lovin' life as a combat rogue, honestly. 0/41/20, with a fist on the mainhand and a mace in the off because that was the luck of the drops, I'm blowing away my brother (who's mutilate) on the meters every night. He's still rollin' with the Ring of Blood dagger and Daub'mid's Crysknife, so we'll see how the numbers stack up once he has a pair of 70 DPS weapons.
In terms of talents, however, I think we got an enormous boost in group desirability for a couple of reasons. Buff, nerf, whatever, what matters is whether we're seen as a desirable addition to a group.
One, Imp Sap is no longer an iffy proposition, it's reliable, useful CC, particularly since BC instances have all been filled with a great many humanoids. It's so much so, in fact, that our guild's lack of mages above 62 isn't slowing down our progression through the 5-mans.
Two, trainable Cloak of Shadows and the realignment of talents like Imp Backstab and Imp SnD into trees more appropriate for a given build has made many of our builds more efficient, permitting greater DPS -- frequently with less aggro -- and tighter builds than was possible pre-2.0.
It doesn't hurt that three of the first 5 70s in our raiding group were rogues.
Clata
Clan Poast, Shadow Council
As others have said, I don't think we were nerfed what so ever, just doesn't seem that we have scaled with the other classes. I was fine around lvl 63/4 but now I've hit 69 other classes are just blowing me into the dust.
Druids seem to be taking over the roost. Good job I had a lvl 60 druid as well to level.
I used a ripost built -sword-Combat spec for leveling, I found it very usefull for not only damage output but reducing the damage incoming damage from disarm/parries.
I have to say I absolutely love the subtlety tree. I was originally combat way back in 1.6, but after 2.0, I felt I needed to try subtlety at least once and was immediately hooked. Shadowstep Ambushing for 3k more than makes up for most of my opponents' larger HP pools.
- Sindrii, Gorgonnash
To be honest, I feel like as if we're not "nerfed" per say, but rather we're still uber but standing at the same spot. The other classes have been given slight "boosts", so that I feel like as if I've been nerfed.
oh well....we'll see :p
I was a deep sub build prior to TBC and was devastated when it was first learned that my baby (CoS) was to be taken away from me. I looked at SS and thought to myself..."Why are you making me wait until 66 for my CoS and giving me this in return...damn you Blizzard!"
Boy was i wrong.
I gave it a shot and specced back to 41 sub. In my first wsg I happened across a hunter on top of his tunnel entrance firing down at my party. I popped SS and guess where I was....yes....behind him! You could tell by his flustered movement that he was not expecting the ganking he received :)
From that day on there has been no looking back.
In instances and raids it is great to be able to safely SS into a group of mobs to sap the problem target. It has become a crucial and well received talent that my whole guild adore me having. And when I got my CoS back it made me feel even more superior.
On top of all that the deep sub bonuses have allowed me to constantly exceed even mages on a raid or instance damage meter. In fact i havent been beaten yet. Saying that though ive yet to go alongside a deep combat build - but hey give me my moment of glory.
All i can say in conclusion is "Well done Blizzard for a great addition to the rogue arsenal!"
Im combat swords. and i never saw a problem untill about 65. i found shadowrend on my first run through ramparts, which was nice as i didn't have a worth while sword at 60.
at about 65 i happened to come up against a mage with ice lance when my vanish and sprint cooldowns were out... and i have never been so sickened in my life. he just stood there spamming these things at me for all my hp whilst i was frozen, near 7000 at that time. druids in bear form are also getting irritating. it takes me a good 3 weeks to kill one now. their damage is not that hard to deal with. but there is no escape option any more. even with CloS mangle is such a huge pain. for a 40 energy move its just plain too good. just goto kite em and get back in very fast if they change form to heal.
at the lower levels 60-64 there was too many people about to bother about being ganked. it just didn't happen... once i got through a few zones and found there were less people about. i noticed that the biggest down side to being a rogue is everyone is afraid... the old "best attack him first, or he might kill u" trick comes into play a lot
i found myself killing allies first to get to the mobs :/ ofcourse quite amusing, but at times i just wanted to kill 5 mobs an run, and it took me far too long coz i had to kill as many allies.
and up untill 70 you will despise druids and anyone that is. for the shear ammount of times your just grinding happilly and out of fucking nowhere someone drops on your head and beats the crap out of your vulnerable unstealthed self. druids dropping from the sky and opening with fairy fire puts you in a terrible position. warriors opening with rend, etc.. its just a pain. and there's very little you can do.... its like givin everyone stealth when they just appear out of nowhere. quite frustrating... but there's nothing i like more than dropping out the sky on some poor unsuspecting drood in cat form
;>
you spelled 'lose' wrong
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